[**DONOTDELETE**]

Well, I can't speak for anyone else... but I *CAN* speak for myself, and will:

Recently, I notcied this little post elsewhere in the Fourm:

'Great go ahead, we going to get another big talking Gunslinger? Great site and then leaves it fallow for a year and then dropps off the site having fulfilled zero promises made on his site. That's the norm, flash in the pan. All talk and no action.'

Hmm... Well, I HAVE been a little lax in updating, recently - but I'd suggest that B.I. check my page again. I've posted minor updates CONSIDERABLY more recent then 'a year ago'...

Apparently, the fact that I don't get paid one... red... cent... for my work here doesn't matter to B.I. and others. Sure, I should post enormous emounts of stories, images or other content and - hey, why not? It CERTAINLY couldn't be the fact that I'm currently working two jobs to keep afloat financially and barely have time to eat or **82**, much less write! No, mundane matters such as that have NO impact on all the goodies I should be churning out 'en masse' for my... well, considering B.I.'s tone and words, I certainly can't say 'my fans', now can I?

As for 'zero' of my promises... Well, the archive's there, what little of it there is right now, and there;s content inside.... Perhaps B.I is currently upset becuase it was HIS story request that hasn't been done, while others have?

Personally, I've had it up to about here... (Gesture at own throat) ...with certain people. As much as I enjoy writing BE and other stories, I have this funny tendancy - I like to eat, occasionally **82**, and have a roof over my head in case it rains. Oddly enough, I *DO* put this ahead of my story-writing, in terms or priority. The people who have problems seeing - and dealing - with this little fact of life can... well, i'm sure all of you can finish that sentance with the appropriate vulgar suggestion that might spring to mind.

Perhaps B.I. and his ilk would be that much happier - downright overjoyed - if I were to promise to 'swiftly and silently vanish away'? I'm sure that I could fulfill a promise to NEVER WRITE A DAMNED WORD for all those ingrates out there...null

[Pacman]

Couldn't have said it myself.

Some of us see things from a perspective very similar to you Gunslinger..

It's a shame not everyone seems to understand.

[SpiderJerusalem]

I think it's especially rediculous because it is porn after all. And volunteer porn at that. It's not cranked out by some corporate hierarchy. And furthermore, the story archive is free for the most part. How cool is that?

I figure that if I get one story every six months like "A Cup Above" or "Your Fetish or Mine" I'm fortunate. Hell, I'm happy that stuff even exists.

[ June 14, 2001: Message edited by: Mr. Rhinoceros ]

[Prophet_Tenebrae]

Well the problem is that you have a community which is essentially a pyramid.

At the bottom you have all the various hardworking and not so hardworking contributers - who support the huge mass of people that contribute nothing up at the top. Is it any surprise that you can't keep all of the people happy all of the time?

As a community the BE one seems to be one that is the least able to sing the praises of it's champions and the quickest to complain at a lack of free stuff.

[ATClown]

Gunslinger, if it's worth anything.  Some of us do appreciate your efforts, as well as the efforts of anybody who runs an archive or page.  Especially considering this is only a hobby.

It's all part of the Great Customer Service Travesty that has befallen America.  We now have two entire generations of Americans who believe that because they pay money for something (or even frequent a site enough), they are somehow owed something more than what is advertised.

And when somebody steps in what they think is their God-given (or hard fought for and bought) way, watch out.  They'll throw a bitch fit the likes of which hasn't been seen.

At least since the previous bitch fit.

[ June 14, 2001: Message edited by: ATClown ]

[The_Rocketeer]

Bad Irving,

I'm sorry to say that it is not our (content creators) responsibility to make everyone happy here. We do what we can whenever possible and outside of free membership, receive nothing in compensation for our efforts. My own gallery remained untouched for more than a year because life had other plans for me. If it is a question of a site that never is updated and is only taking up space, the answer will come from the Webmaster. I might suggest that before you
criticize, try it. Then get used to the fact that in spite of our own desires, sometimes things go the way they go and we have to adapt.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

To clear up a few points...

First of all, I NEVER claimed to be an expert at HTML or actually MAINTAINING the arvhice in a technical way. I hereby thank the generous help of everybody who DID make the physical archive section possible. As for the content... the few items *I*, personally, added into the page since June 2000 DID NOT GET LISTED in my 'What's New' section. I just tossed them into the main page itself. This, I'll rediliy admit, is my 'fault', completely and utterly.

Secondly: Perhaps B.I. has a hard time grasping this basic premise: I DON'T OWE HIM A THING! I don't get paid for my work here, and that MEANS exactly what it SAYS. None of his 'hard earned' money, spent on membership, comes to me. What might be confusing B.I. is this fact: I owe the BEA OWNER something, in return for the pleasent gift he has given me of access to the site. Perhaps the OWNER owes B.I. and other members something more then what they are currently getting. (which MAY be why he's instituted the free-membership-for-work' policy, so as to have more content for the MEMBERS, even if it's only a LITTLE more.)

However, that is NOT my concern. What happens between the Owner and myself about my archive is OUR business. Problems YOU may have with him about the site, or membership, is YOUR business. Kindly learn the distinction...

Again, I ask: Would you RATHER that I hadn't accepted the 'free' membership and done as much as I have? Would it make you happy if I NEVER did anything else on this site?

Sir, this is not a rhetorical question. Answer it, if you will. Somehow, does the fact that I HAVE contributed - but not up to YOUR standards - actually, somehow, rob you of something? If so, just say the word...

[ June 14, 2001: Message edited by: Gunslinger ]

[jat470]

...And there it is. So what's the owner have to say about this and the Mark T. issue. I think of all the opinions being expressed, that's the one I would like to hear the most right now.

[ATClown]

My point was, there's no point in bitching or complaining.  It only serves to make others annoyed with you.

Just end your membership.

It's what I did.

[sheber]

Whoa. While I appreciate all content providers, I seldom take the chance to directly tell them. My bad. After thinking about the views in this thread, I've come up with two possible solutions: 1) Staff a customer/creator friendly manager that will handle the rift between the two factions (and I call him/her/it a manager because one cannot obviously force content out of anybody, but could definately give the creator the positive reinforcement needed to chide things along. 2)Move those sections of the BEA that will not change into an archival department (ie. f-files, etc...)
so new content will not be expected.
My two cents, for what its worth.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Gentlemen,

I have been following this thread with both increasing amusement as well as annoyance. Annoyance simply because I find it unbecoming of members (whether fee-paying or not) of this community to bitch around the way they do and start flame wars against each other for ridiculous reasons. Amusement because it took nearly a dozen posts until ATClown came up with the obvious solution: Bad Irving, or anyone else for that matter, should end their membership when they are not happy with what they get. I believe no one forced you into a membership and I am pretty certain nobody will make you stay if you wish to leave. Let the market forces decide on this issue: If there happens to be a mass exodus of disappointed members and a correspondingly sharp drop in revenue I am sure the owners will swiftly come up with ideas to turn things around. Whether that is additional content, an end to free memberships for contributers, free membership for all with a deterioration of content quality, or any combination of the aforesaid, we would see. If it is only a handful of ungrateful troublemakers, the BEA will survive, maintain its high level of quality and members can peacefully enjoy their pastime.

In order not to give a wrong impression, I am a paying member, I am happy to stay one for as long as I think I get value for my money, and I will end my membership when this changes. I will not make accusations of being robbed of my hard earned money, neither will I expect to be begged to stay.

Value out of one's membership is a very personal thing. I, for my part, consider it value enough to be able to access the Members' Gallery so that I can browse it at my leasure and don't miss any posts in the Users' Gallery (larger files and posts recycled to the member section), a high price as it may seem. There are times when members/guests post to these galleries in rapid succession, and there are "slow times" as well. However, it would never occur to me to complain when there is not enough movement. Bad Irving, you might wish to acknowledge that your membership fee includes access to a vast array of galleries and other servives. The pricing philosophy here at the BEA is "you get for what you pay" and not "you pay for what you get". Hence, I believe it is grossly unfair to claim slow posts in the Users' Gallery or infrequent updates in any other gallery is steeling money from members. We pay for the whole lot, not just for our particular favourites. Buy any magazine and you will surely find stories, articles or photographs you like more than others. I don't expect you to be the type of person sometimes seen at newsstands who literally read a magazine from front to back cover and vice versa before they buy it. So if, after the third or fourth issue you find that there aren't enough articles that are to your liking, you will simply not buy it again or cancel your subscription. You wouldn't write letters to the editor and complain about being ripped off, would you? So why do you do it here?

Just my humble opinion, for what it's worth.

Cheers,

BoobJiggler

P.s., to Gunslinger: I can sympathise with you. I had been a much more active member (in terms of posts in the galleries and the forum) here some time ago. I even thought of asking the owners for some space for my own gallery; not because I would get a free membership out of it (I didn't even know there is such a thing) but simply because I was running out of space at my own little place. However, I then reached a stage in my life where things other than morphing and animating boobs got higher in priority, and I withdrew almost completely for a few months. That irritated some (at least Magic), and I am sorry I disappointed them. Others may not have bothered the least bit. That's fine with me but it would have outraged me if anyone had accused me of ripping them of. Let's keep our calm, go about our own business, hope for times when we can devote more time again to the BEA and that our contributions, however infrequent they may be, will be appreciated by members.

[sc]

Well, this is a familiar sort of thread.

Guess it musta just been time for it to come up in the rotation list.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

One person complained. That means everybody is ungrateful.  Is anybody here in a real business.  You know how many complaints a real business gets.  People bitch. I guess what you all are saying is that BEA should not be used for anything and all these gallieres and stuff are like history and never will be updated. Sit down shutup pay money get nothing.  No wonder you tell people to leave.

[Zorlond]

I'd just like to say right off the bat that I am -not- taking any position on this debate. I'm just voicing thoughts about what I've read here. That said, I'll do just that.

ATClown mentioned that people bitch when they don't get what they paid for. How many beer commercials have you seen with beautiful young people sharing laughs, and implying a lot more? How many beauty products being used by people who clearly have NO need for them? Diet/exercise stuff with people who obviously work out in a gym, and not at home?

People naturally want what they pay for. Unfortunately, people are selling things they have no hope or intention of delivering, they have been for decades. So people bitch. Where are the babes hanging on their every word? Why are their teeth still an ugly shade of yellow? Why is this flab roll still here?

Knowingly or not, the advertisers are just exacerbating the situation by upping the ante every year. So people bitch even more. I'm still waiting for critical mass.

The web is not exempt from this behavior. I don't have a membership here anymore, so I can't judge what goes on (or doesn't) in the members-only areas. But people have set up sites and left them to rot ALL OVER the web, it's nothing new. So now, everyone is hyper-sensitive to that sort of behavior, and the slightest percieved failure to deliver ends up in a flame war.

So the question remains. When is the net going to reach critical mass? And what will happen?

[ June 15, 2001: Message edited by: Zorlond ]

[Prophet_Tenebrae]

Answer: The net will reach critical mass when Amazon turns a profit.

Result - the world will cease to exist and we can all rest in blessed oblivion without Bad Irving and Gunslinger playing a blame game and a lot of paying members that seem unaware they can stop paying at any time.

I for one am looking forward to it.