[andrat2000]

Trumpel the extremist fake news producer no. 1 in this world. He thanks German army for their good job doing security of the G20 meeting.

Mr. d(r)umb(el) president, if the German army would do such kind of job within Germany we would have the largest constitution crisis ever. We would be on the rim of a civil war caused by such a military job. Because of our experience in 3rd Reich with the Nazis and the "Wehrmacht" we were only allowed to have a defence Army and not being used internally against the own citizenship. The German army is controlled by our parliament.

So no job on the streets of Hamburg for the German army. Your fake news propaganda are big nothing (ham)burgers...

IDIOT  .... If you would only stop tweeting BULLSHIT.

[Hiram]

Because of our experience in 3rd Reich with the Nazis and the "Wehrmacht" we were only allowed to have a defence Army and not being used internally against the own citizenship. The German army is controlled by our parliament.

Correct me if I am wrong - but didn't the army deploy to Afghanistan?

[andrat2000]

Because of our experience in 3rd Reich with the Nazis and the "Wehrmacht" we were only allowed to have a defence Army and not being used internally against the own citizenship. The German army is controlled by our parliament.

Correct me if I am wrong - but didn't the army deploy to Afghanistan?

This part has changed with the Kosovo war. We got forced by NATO partners to do more. I'm not happy with this considering the young federal republic of Germany had 6 years no army after it's founding. Still the German army within Germany only allowed for defence against external armies or assistance in calamities e.g. flooding.

[Hiram]

We got forced by NATO partners to do more.

How do you feel about the 2% of GDP spending on defence that NATO requires of members.  Trump has been vocal about recently, accusing Germany of not spending enough.

[andrat2000]

We got forced by NATO partners to do more.

How do you feel about the 2% of GDP spending on defence that NATO requires of members.  Trump has been vocal about recently, accusing Germany of not spending enough.

The 2% spending for NATO is a guiding value that should be reached by 2024. Nothing more, nothing less.

On German Autobahn we have a guinding velocity at 130 km/h. Vehicles that can at least drive 60km/h can use the Autobahn. And you can drive your Porsche, Ferrari or AMG at 300km/h. You just need to make sure neither the low nor the high velocity doesn't cause any trouble to the other traffic participants.

So if someone is spending much more to NATO and then complains about it, maybe his spending doesn't fit to the guiding value and thus doesn't fit to the rest of the NATO participants.
And currently Germany is already rasing our spendings in military. The only problem is ... we don't want certain weapons:
- no air craft carrier
- no nuclear weapons
- no nuclear powered ships and submarines
- Germany has 226 citizen per Square-Kilometer (US has 33 citizen per Square-Kilomenter) so it's hard to have more aircraft bases, military training grounds or whatever without troubling the people ...
- more adventure in wars ? Really?
- we have a wide base of people in Germany that believe in disarmament. So how should the responsibles in our country act against the people?

This explains the situation quite well, unfortunately in German, but Google translate is your friend:
http://www.zeit.de/politik/ausland/2017-02/nato-donald-trump-eu-beitraege-forderung-5vor8

As always in their FAKE NEWS propaganda from Whitehouse under Trumpel reaching the guiding value by 2024 was not mentioned by the US when they started with troublemaking. And I'm sure 90% of the Trumpel fans still don't know that it is A) a guiding value and B) target year is 2024.

[Hiram]

The 2% spending for NATO is a guiding value that should be reached by 2024. Nothing more, nothing less.

Fair point.

So if someone is spending much more to NATO and then complains about it, maybe his spending doesn't fit to the guiding value and thus doesn't fit to the rest of the NATO participants.

Another good point.

And currently Germany is already rasing our spendings in military. The only problem is ... we don't want certain weapons:
- no air craft carrier
- no nuclear weapons
- no nuclear powered ships and submarines
- Germany has 226 citizen per Square-Kilometer (US has 33 citizen per Square-Kilomenter) so it's hard to have more aircraft bases, military training grounds or whatever without troubling the people ...

Although, the UK is a much smaller country and we have all of those. But why country like the UK needs all that is unclear to me.

- more adventure in wars ? Really?

I certainly hope not. I am clear in mind that the last few wars in the Middle East have promoted Islamic fundamentalism - which has led to terrorism. Not good.   

[andrat2000]

How many millions cost was the G20 meeting for the American tax payers? So the emporer Trumpel could travel with his royal household and achieve exactly what in Hamburg?

A big nothing (Ham)burger?

[TheZookie007]

The Atlantic: "If There Was No Collusion, It Wasn’t for Lack of Trying"
Donald Trump Jr. made clear he was willing to receive damaging information about Hillary Clinton from a Russian lawyer in a June 2016 meeting.

Since his presidential campaign was first alleged by critics to have colluded with the Russian government to undermine Hillary Clinton, Donald Trump has been consistent—and unusually so—in steadfastly denying it. Now it seems clear that if his denials are true, it isn’t because Trump’s advisers were **86** to collude. And that confirmation comes, surprisingly, from Trump’s own son and namesake, Donald Trump Jr...

“The woman stated that she had information that individuals connected to Russia were funding the Democratic National Committee and supporting Mrs. Clinton,” Trump Jr. said in a statement. “Her statements were vague, ambiguous, and made no sense. No details or supporting information was provided or even offered.” Instead, he complained, she just railed against the Magnitsky Act.

In other words, Trump Jr. admitted (while acknowledging a prior lie) that he was open to receiving damaging information about Hillary Clinton from the Russian lawyer; he was just frustrated that she didn’t seem to have it. If there was no collusion between the Kremlin and the Trump inner circle, it was not because top Trump aides were against it.

Trump Jr.’s admission here is remarkable. Donald Trump’s tendency to speak unwisely remains one of his greatest weaknesses—his threat to release apparently fictive tapes resulted in a special-counsel investigation that has rocked his still-young presidency—and his chi1dren are a chip off the old block. (Eric Trump has admitted, contra claims of separation, that he continues to talk business with his father.)

It is possible that, as Trump Jr. says, he did not know the identity or background of the  lawyer with whom he was meeting. The Trump family has a history of failing (or simply declining) to do due diligence in its business projects. Trump Jr. got into hot water during the campaign when he appeared on a white supremacist’s radio show; he claimed he did not know the man’s views. The president has also posted material from social-media users who espouse abhorrent views, apparently without vetting them, as recently as last week. Manafort, who has extensive connections to Kremlin-tied politicians and businessmen, might have been more likely to be aware of who Veselnitskaya was...

What was it that Mark Twain said? “[He] was endowed with a stupidity which by the least little stretch would go around the globe four times and tie.” He also said (in his tongue-in-cheek essay "On the Decay of the Art of Lying"):

Lying is universal--we all do it; we all must do it. Therefore, the wise thing is for us diligently to train ourselves to lie thoughtfully, judiciously; to lie with a good object, and not an evil one; to lie for others' advantage, and not our own; to lie healingly, charitably, humanely, not cruelly, hurtfully, maliciously; to lie gracefully and graciously, not awkwardly and clumsily; to lie firmly, frankly, squarely, with head erect, not haltingly, tortuously, with pusillanimous mien, as being ashamed of our high calling.

[rtpoe]

It's going to be pretty hard to say that meeting was an innocent chat about the Magnitsky Act....

Especially when you bring Jared Kushner and Paul Manafort along with you.

In their usual snarky manner, Wonkette quotes people who know about presidential campaigns just how weird this is.

---

"Rick Tyler, a former top aide to the presidential campaign of Sen. Ted Cruz, Texas, said he would have called the FBI if approached by a foreign agent from an adversarial nation like Russia.

“Senior presidential campaign officials don’t take meetings with nameless people. Doesn’t happen,” Tyler said.

---

Michael Steel, a former top aide to the presidential campaign of former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush, said the presence of a campaign manager at such a meeting would be unusual.

“Aside from the candidate himself, the campaign manager’s time is among the most valuable resources for any campaign,” he told HuffPost. “So, yes, it would be very odd for the campaign manager to appear at a meeting with a more-or-less random foreigner claiming they’re peddling [opposition research.]”

---

Here’s George W. Bush’s ethics lawyer Richard Painter, cutting right to the chase:

"This is treason. He must have known that the only way Russia would get such information was by spying."

---

We may not yet have a smoking gun regarding collusion, but there's a strong smell of cordite in the air here.

If there is no collusion (and it really would be best if there weren't), how does one explain the many, many, business and financial connections between Russia and the Trump campaign team? How does one justify the notable pro-Russia leanings of Trump (going way back to the beginning of his campaign)? And why are so many of them getting caught lying about all their meetings with Russians?

[TheZookie007]

If there is no collusion (and it really would be best if there weren't), how does one explain the many, many, business and financial connections between Russia and the Trump campaign team? How does one justify the notable pro-Russia leanings of Trump (going way back to the beginning of his campaign)? And why are so many of them getting caught lying about all their meetings with Russians?

Isn't it obvious? It's all the fault of George Soros!

[TheZookie007]

Until now I didn't have the facts and figures to back me up, just a strong hunch. But now I know for sure: the GOP is the twenty-first century revival of the Know Nothings.

Pew Research Center: "Sharp Partisan Divisions in Views of National Institutions"
Republicans increasingly say colleges have negative impact on U.S.

As recently as two years ago, most Republicans and Republican leaners held a positive view of the role of colleges and universities. In September 2015, 54% of Republicans said colleges and universities had a positive impact on the way things were going in the country; 37% rated their impact negatively.

By 2016, Republicans’ ratings of colleges and universities were mixed (43% positive, 45% negative). Today, for the first time on a question asked since 2010, a majority (58%) of Republicans say colleges and universities are having a negative effect on the way things are going in the country, while 36% say they have a positive effect.

Among Republicans, there is an ideological gap in views of the impact of colleges and universities and other institutions: Nearly two-thirds of conservative Republicans (65%) say colleges are having a negative impact, compared with just 43% of moderate and liberal Republicans.

[TheZookie007]

A refresher on who the Know Nothings were (and are) courtesy of Wikipedia:

The Native American Party, renamed the American Party 1855 and commonly known as the "Know Nothing" movement, was an American Nativist political party that operated nationally in the mid-1850s. It was an anti-Catholic and anti-immigrant movement, generally taking the form of a secret society. Adherents to the movement were to reply "I know nothing" when asked about its specifics by outsiders, thus providing the group with its common appellation.

The "Know Nothings" believed a "Romanist" conspiracy was afoot to subvert civil and religious liberty in America and sought to politically organize native-born Protestants in the defense of traditional religious and political values....

Legacy
The Nativist spirit of the Know Nothing movement was revived in later political movements, such as the American Protective Association of the 1890s and the Ku Klux Klan of the 1920s. In the late 19th century, Democrats would call the Republicans "Know Nothings" in order to secure the votes of Germans, as in the Bennett Law campaign in Wisconsin in 1890. A similar culture war took place in Illinois in 1892, where Democrat John Peter Altgeld denounced the Republicans:

"The spirit which enacted the Alien and Sedition laws, the spirit which actuated the "Know-nothing" party, the spirit which is forever carping about the foreign-born citizen and trying to abridge his privileges, is too deeply seated in the party. The aristocratic and know-nothing principle has been circulating in its system so long that it will require more than one somersault to shake the poison out of its bones."

The term has become a provocative slur, suggesting that the opponent is both nativist and ignorant. George Wallace's 1968 presidential campaign was said by Time to be under the "neo-Know Nothing banner". Fareed Zakaria wrote that politicians who "encourage[d] Americans to fear foreigners" were becoming "modern incarnations of the Know-Nothings." In 2006, an editorial in The Weekly Standard by neoconservative William Kristol accused populist Republicans of "turning the GOP into an anti-immigration, Know-Nothing party." The lead editorial of the May 20, 2007, edition of The New York Times on a proposed immigration bill, referred to "this generation's Know-Nothings." An editorial written by Timothy Egan in The New York Times on August 27, 2010, entitled "Building a Nation of Know-Nothings" discussed the birther movement, which falsely claimed that Barack Obama was not a natural-born United States citizen, which is a requirement for the office of President of the United States.

In the 2016 United States Presidential Election, a number of commentators and politicians compared candidate Donald Trump to the Know Nothings due to his anti-illegal immigration policies.

[andrat2000]

So in an attempt to gather incriminating material against Hillary Clinton, Trumpel jr. was willing to give away the US to Russia.

What's the sentence in the US for high treason?

[StrikezOne]

Same old shit isnt it?

Liberal media mod picks a story, pastes it 24/7.. "Russians! Collusion!"

Blah, blah, blah.

A few days pass, find out its all bullshit and a big nothing burger..

So start up a new one!

It's going to be pretty hard to say that meeting was an innocent chat about the Magnitsky Act....

How hard was it to say that the Loretta Lynch and Bill Clinton meeting was an innocent chat about... grandchildren?

Oh thats right, we never question democrats around here.

[TheZookie007]

Only a deliberately- and willfully-ignorant partisan would look at this and think it's justifiable, or that it in any way has a counterpart on the Democrat side. Because as Rep. Eric Swalwell (House Intelligence Committee) said:

"...to receive damaging information from a representative of a foreign adversary -- that's a betrayal of our country... this is not like somebody who walks in and says 'I work in politics and I've got some information on your opponent.' This is somebody who is from Russia, where very often Russian nationals are connected to the Russian Intelligence Services, especially around politics, and so the fact that this wasn't passed along to the FBI or the Department of State also very much concerns me."

It's incredible to think that there are still people who reflexively support this, and who continue to characterize "collusion" as "no big deal, the other side did it too, and Obama! Hillary! Podesta! Emails!" It's not "merely" collusion. This is aiding, abetting, and participating in espionage against these United States, in pursuit of political power (and self-enrichment).

Seth Abramson's Mega-Thread on Trump Jr.-Russia Meet: A useful timeline and explainer